1 00:00:15,049 --> 00:00:03,290 you're listening to Ira the inception 2 00:00:18,710 --> 00:00:15,059 radio network Chicago Illinois you're 3 00:00:23,990 --> 00:00:18,720 listening to I RN 2014 orders of 4 00:00:26,810 --> 00:00:24,000 international yoga conference one of the 5 00:00:28,820 --> 00:00:26,820 neat things about being a researcher is 6 00:00:31,250 --> 00:00:28,830 that we don't get to see each other 7 00:00:33,290 --> 00:00:31,260 often so when we have conferences like 8 00:00:36,020 --> 00:00:33,300 this it's kind of nice for all of us to 9 00:00:38,119 --> 00:00:36,030 get together and share information and 10 00:00:41,780 --> 00:00:38,129 visit it and get to know each other 11 00:00:44,299 --> 00:00:41,790 again author journalist and TV 12 00:00:46,880 --> 00:00:44,309 personality Nick pole was in charge of 13 00:00:49,520 --> 00:00:46,890 the British government x-files for 21 14 00:00:52,310 --> 00:00:49,530 years at the british ministry of defence 15 00:00:54,229 --> 00:00:52,320 he investigated UFO sightings looking 16 00:00:57,229 --> 00:00:54,239 for evidence of a potential threat to 17 00:01:00,500 --> 00:00:57,239 national defence his highly classified 18 00:01:02,479 --> 00:01:00,510 work included alien abductions crop 19 00:01:05,359 --> 00:01:02,489 circles and government psychic 20 00:01:06,859 --> 00:01:05,369 experiments when details and Nick's work 21 00:01:09,950 --> 00:01:06,869 were released under the Freedom of 22 00:01:13,219 --> 00:01:09,960 Information Act the media called in the 23 00:01:14,390 --> 00:01:13,229 real Fox Mulder nick is now recognized 24 00:01:17,480 --> 00:01:14,400 as one of the world's leading 25 00:01:20,390 --> 00:01:17,490 authorities on UFOs the unexplained 26 00:01:23,450 --> 00:01:20,400 conspiracy theory theories and French 27 00:01:25,760 --> 00:01:23,460 science he has worked as a consultant on 28 00:01:29,060 --> 00:01:25,770 numerous Hollywood films and TV shows 29 00:01:30,980 --> 00:01:29,070 about aliens and outer space he is also 30 00:01:34,609 --> 00:01:30,990 the best-selling author of four books 31 00:01:37,670 --> 00:01:34,619 one on UFOs one on alien abductions and 32 00:01:47,960 --> 00:01:37,680 two science fiction novels ladies and 33 00:01:54,390 --> 00:01:50,670 well thank you very much indeed for that 34 00:01:59,340 --> 00:01:54,400 introduction Dennis and also my profound 35 00:02:02,010 --> 00:01:59,350 thanks to noe to Brad to everyone else 36 00:02:05,130 --> 00:02:02,020 who has helped with the organization of 37 00:02:07,050 --> 00:02:05,140 the border zone UFO fest of all the dude 38 00:02:10,230 --> 00:02:07,060 of the Dead event and all the other 39 00:02:12,600 --> 00:02:10,240 festivities and of course above all to 40 00:02:15,840 --> 00:02:12,610 the city of Presidio itself for playing 41 00:02:18,450 --> 00:02:15,850 host to this event it's my first time 42 00:02:20,820 --> 00:02:18,460 here I hope it's going to be the first 43 00:02:23,490 --> 00:02:20,830 of many times because I sense that this 44 00:02:27,060 --> 00:02:23,500 festival is going to grow and grow and 45 00:02:29,250 --> 00:02:27,070 that there is really the we're in at the 46 00:02:30,840 --> 00:02:29,260 beginnings of something exciting here 47 00:02:35,400 --> 00:02:30,850 and I'm sure it's going to go from 48 00:02:39,650 --> 00:02:35,410 strength to strength so I'm very glad to 49 00:02:43,710 --> 00:02:39,660 be here and in this first of my two 50 00:02:46,770 --> 00:02:43,720 presentations today I want to be a 51 00:02:51,750 --> 00:02:46,780 little bit more speculative and I think 52 00:02:54,949 --> 00:02:51,760 very often in the UFO community one gets 53 00:02:59,310 --> 00:02:54,959 bogged down into what I call a sort of 54 00:03:03,360 --> 00:02:59,320 skeptic versus believer dogfight no is 55 00:03:06,830 --> 00:03:03,370 this real is this not real are we being 56 00:03:09,440 --> 00:03:06,840 visited or not is it really 57 00:03:11,970 --> 00:03:09,450 extraterrestrials or is it all just 58 00:03:18,000 --> 00:03:11,980 misidentifications hoaxes or delusions 59 00:03:21,930 --> 00:03:18,010 and it seems to me that there is quite a 60 00:03:26,040 --> 00:03:21,940 kind of entrenched viewpoint on probably 61 00:03:28,440 --> 00:03:26,050 on both sides so very often you're not 62 00:03:32,400 --> 00:03:28,450 really going to change people's minds by 63 00:03:36,449 --> 00:03:32,410 getting into that what is it is it or 64 00:03:40,520 --> 00:03:36,459 isn't it a kind of dog fight so rather 65 00:03:43,380 --> 00:03:40,530 than try to make a case for the UFO and 66 00:03:45,690 --> 00:03:43,390 I'm guessing that as we're all here at a 67 00:03:47,490 --> 00:03:45,700 UFO festival it would be kind of like 68 00:03:49,229 --> 00:03:47,500 preaching to the choir anyway I'm 69 00:03:50,729 --> 00:03:49,239 suspecting there is quite a lot of 70 00:03:52,949 --> 00:03:50,739 people here who are pretty much 71 00:03:55,440 --> 00:03:52,959 convinced anyway so what's the point my 72 00:03:57,660 --> 00:03:55,450 my spending time trying to convince you 73 00:04:01,500 --> 00:03:57,670 let's get beyond 74 00:04:04,130 --> 00:04:01,510 and that kind of question and ask what I 75 00:04:08,580 --> 00:04:04,140 think are the more interesting questions 76 00:04:11,790 --> 00:04:08,590 it is the well okay the search for alien 77 00:04:15,240 --> 00:04:11,800 life is one thing but what happens if we 78 00:04:19,460 --> 00:04:15,250 find it what next what will be the 79 00:04:22,740 --> 00:04:19,470 effects on political structures on 80 00:04:25,650 --> 00:04:22,750 science and technology on religious 81 00:04:29,129 --> 00:04:25,660 belief on personal paradigms and 82 00:04:31,530 --> 00:04:29,139 worldview how will this affect us will 83 00:04:34,530 --> 00:04:31,540 it be the greatest game changer of all 84 00:04:37,530 --> 00:04:34,540 time or actually will life go on pretty 85 00:04:41,340 --> 00:04:37,540 much as normal and that's really the 86 00:04:48,930 --> 00:04:41,350 meat of what I want to get into in this 87 00:04:52,940 --> 00:04:48,940 presentation now one of the possible 88 00:04:55,530 --> 00:04:52,950 scenarios for how this might unfold and 89 00:04:58,620 --> 00:04:55,540 I know that a lot of people in the UFO 90 00:05:00,930 --> 00:04:58,630 community are not great fans of this but 91 00:05:03,360 --> 00:05:00,940 I think it is important to recognize 92 00:05:07,170 --> 00:05:03,370 what other people in the field are doing 93 00:05:11,600 --> 00:05:07,180 out there one of the main ways that we 94 00:05:14,300 --> 00:05:11,610 might get absolutely irrefutable 95 00:05:18,830 --> 00:05:14,310 scientific you can take that to the bank 96 00:05:22,260 --> 00:05:18,840 proof of all this is picking up a 97 00:05:25,890 --> 00:05:22,270 verifiable repeatable signal from 98 00:05:29,250 --> 00:05:25,900 another civilization this is a great way 99 00:05:32,310 --> 00:05:29,260 of actually taking us beyond evidence 100 00:05:37,969 --> 00:05:32,320 and into definitive proof because it 101 00:05:42,290 --> 00:05:37,979 fulfills that the scientific concepts of 102 00:05:44,940 --> 00:05:42,300 repeatability and and verification and 103 00:05:46,730 --> 00:05:44,950 one of the ways in which this might 104 00:05:49,800 --> 00:05:46,740 happen is the use of radio telescopes 105 00:05:54,600 --> 00:05:49,810 and how many of you here have seen the 106 00:05:58,710 --> 00:05:54,610 sci-fi movie contact great it is one of 107 00:06:01,500 --> 00:05:58,720 my favorite science fiction movies for a 108 00:06:03,779 --> 00:06:01,510 couple of reasons firstly arguably it's 109 00:06:07,159 --> 00:06:03,789 not really a movie about aliens at all 110 00:06:11,540 --> 00:06:07,169 it's a movie about us also 111 00:06:14,239 --> 00:06:11,550 it is a movie which i think is based on 112 00:06:16,730 --> 00:06:14,249 some very good science it was based on a 113 00:06:19,879 --> 00:06:16,740 book written by the late great carl 114 00:06:22,309 --> 00:06:19,889 sagan the great astronomer and science 115 00:06:25,100 --> 00:06:22,319 communicator and for those of you who 116 00:06:29,029 --> 00:06:25,110 haven't read the book how many have read 117 00:06:32,510 --> 00:06:29,039 the book ism ah interesting the book is 118 00:06:36,409 --> 00:06:32,520 very much worth your time because in an 119 00:06:39,309 --> 00:06:36,419 even more thorough and thought provoking 120 00:06:43,610 --> 00:06:39,319 way than the movie it gets into the 121 00:06:46,959 --> 00:06:43,620 fundamental i will say conflict but i 122 00:06:50,239 --> 00:06:46,969 think it might be fairer to say 123 00:06:52,999 --> 00:06:50,249 relationship between science and 124 00:06:59,149 --> 00:06:53,009 religion and it does so in a very 125 00:07:02,929 --> 00:06:59,159 thoughtful way i think and so for many 126 00:07:05,300 --> 00:07:02,939 years a number of radio astronomers just 127 00:07:09,529 --> 00:07:05,310 as we see in the movie the the character 128 00:07:12,469 --> 00:07:09,539 of le hour away in the movie is loosely 129 00:07:15,439 --> 00:07:12,479 based on a real person dr. Jill tarter 130 00:07:19,040 --> 00:07:15,449 from the SETI Institute and in fact 131 00:07:22,879 --> 00:07:19,050 jodie foster spent some time talking to 132 00:07:26,869 --> 00:07:22,889 to dr. tartar about her passion for this 133 00:07:29,450 --> 00:07:26,879 and it's one of the great tions between 134 00:07:33,050 --> 00:07:29,460 science fact and science fiction and 135 00:07:38,119 --> 00:07:33,060 ufology and and all these different but 136 00:07:40,279 --> 00:07:38,129 interrelated subjects so what we didn't 137 00:07:43,040 --> 00:07:40,289 see in the movie contact is what's going 138 00:07:46,700 --> 00:07:43,050 on right now the construction of the 139 00:07:48,649 --> 00:07:46,710 world's largest and most powerful radio 140 00:07:54,429 --> 00:07:48,659 telescope called the Square Kilometre 141 00:07:57,800 --> 00:07:54,439 Array and you can see there it's it's 142 00:08:01,639 --> 00:07:57,810 going to be it's based on multiple 143 00:08:06,230 --> 00:08:01,649 dishes based in number of different 144 00:08:09,260 --> 00:08:06,240 countries around the world construction 145 00:08:12,230 --> 00:08:09,270 is is pretty soon gonna get underway and 146 00:08:16,470 --> 00:08:12,240 it is going to be fully operational and 147 00:08:19,600 --> 00:08:16,480 on stream in the year twenty 24 so 148 00:08:23,290 --> 00:08:19,610 very often you'll hear people say when 149 00:08:26,200 --> 00:08:23,300 are we going to get disclosure when will 150 00:08:29,950 --> 00:08:26,210 the human race know that we are not 151 00:08:33,070 --> 00:08:29,960 alone and if you ask me to pick a date 152 00:08:35,970 --> 00:08:33,080 I'm going to go with 20 24 why because 153 00:08:40,480 --> 00:08:35,980 that's when this Square Kilometre Array 154 00:08:44,650 --> 00:08:40,490 telescope comes fully online and just to 155 00:08:51,900 --> 00:08:44,660 give you an idea of the sensitivity and 156 00:08:55,900 --> 00:08:51,910 power of this machine if you imagine the 157 00:09:00,150 --> 00:08:55,910 typical air traffic control radar system 158 00:09:02,950 --> 00:09:00,160 that you have at any American Airport 159 00:09:06,310 --> 00:09:02,960 this Square Kilometre Array radio 160 00:09:10,510 --> 00:09:06,320 telescope would be able to detect that 161 00:09:15,690 --> 00:09:10,520 Airport radar at a distance of around 162 00:09:19,690 --> 00:09:15,700 about 50 light-years translation if 163 00:09:22,720 --> 00:09:19,700 there are other civilizations in our 164 00:09:26,430 --> 00:09:22,730 little part of the galaxy doing the sort 165 00:09:29,920 --> 00:09:26,440 of thing that we're already doing this 166 00:09:33,280 --> 00:09:29,930 Square Kilometre Array telescope will 167 00:09:38,200 --> 00:09:33,290 find them now I'm not in any way in 168 00:09:41,200 --> 00:09:38,210 validating the UFO phenomenon and may be 169 00:09:45,970 --> 00:09:41,210 long before 2024 will yet disclosure 170 00:09:48,040 --> 00:09:45,980 through other means maybe we will get I 171 00:09:51,910 --> 00:09:48,050 suppose the UFO communities ultimate 172 00:09:53,860 --> 00:09:51,920 fantasy you know interruption to normal 173 00:09:57,670 --> 00:09:53,870 broadcasting routines there's going to 174 00:10:00,190 --> 00:09:57,680 be a special presidential address my 175 00:10:05,380 --> 00:10:00,200 fellow Americans people of the world we 176 00:10:07,450 --> 00:10:05,390 are not alone or maybe maybe we'll get 177 00:10:09,730 --> 00:10:07,460 the archetypal landing on the White 178 00:10:12,490 --> 00:10:09,740 House lawn or maybe we'll get something 179 00:10:17,620 --> 00:10:12,500 else but maybe we won't and if we don't 180 00:10:20,890 --> 00:10:17,630 science and radio telescopes might be 181 00:10:25,050 --> 00:10:20,900 the way that this is going to unfold and 182 00:10:27,820 --> 00:10:25,060 if it does unfold that way or in fact 183 00:10:29,800 --> 00:10:27,830 whichever way it unfolds some very 184 00:10:34,930 --> 00:10:29,810 interesting questions 185 00:10:36,970 --> 00:10:34,940 actually arise now I went back in and 186 00:10:41,200 --> 00:10:36,980 one of the great things that you often 187 00:10:46,300 --> 00:10:41,210 hear at UFO conferences is people 188 00:10:49,420 --> 00:10:46,310 complain why is it that the scientific 189 00:10:52,329 --> 00:10:49,430 community is not more interested in this 190 00:10:55,810 --> 00:10:52,339 subject why aren't they seeing what 191 00:10:59,170 --> 00:10:55,820 we're seeing why does science not look 192 00:11:02,470 --> 00:10:59,180 at these sorts of questions well some 193 00:11:07,560 --> 00:11:02,480 good news they are starting to do just 194 00:11:11,920 --> 00:11:07,570 that around about a month ago in 195 00:11:14,680 --> 00:11:11,930 Washington DC there was an event put on 196 00:11:18,900 --> 00:11:14,690 jointly sponsored by NASA and the 197 00:11:22,810 --> 00:11:18,910 Library of Congress an astrobiology 198 00:11:26,710 --> 00:11:22,820 symposium entitled preparing for 199 00:11:30,400 --> 00:11:26,720 discovery now I did not attend that 200 00:11:33,490 --> 00:11:30,410 event so I really I can't discuss that 201 00:11:38,920 --> 00:11:33,500 in in any great detail but what I can 202 00:11:42,130 --> 00:11:38,930 discuss is to Royal Society discussion 203 00:11:44,890 --> 00:11:42,140 meetings that took place in the United 204 00:11:49,329 --> 00:11:44,900 Kingdom back in 2010 now I did go to 205 00:11:52,540 --> 00:11:49,339 both of those and the Royal Society for 206 00:11:54,660 --> 00:11:52,550 those not familiar with it is arguably 207 00:12:00,310 --> 00:11:54,670 the world's oldest and most prestigious 208 00:12:04,540 --> 00:12:00,320 scientific organization it just a few 209 00:12:07,600 --> 00:12:04,550 years ago celebrated its 300th 210 00:12:12,520 --> 00:12:07,610 anniversary pretty impressive previous 211 00:12:17,790 --> 00:12:12,530 fellows include Sir Isaac Newton Albert 212 00:12:21,000 --> 00:12:17,800 Einstein more recently Stephen Hawking 213 00:12:24,730 --> 00:12:21,010 so this is a pretty eminent body and in 214 00:12:31,630 --> 00:12:24,740 2010 as I say they put on these two 215 00:12:34,420 --> 00:12:31,640 discussion meetings and they had I think 216 00:12:36,550 --> 00:12:34,430 the most provocative titles that I've 217 00:12:39,750 --> 00:12:36,560 ever come across at a scientific meeting 218 00:12:43,050 --> 00:12:39,760 the first one was called 219 00:12:47,340 --> 00:12:43,060 the detection of extraterrestrial life 220 00:12:52,940 --> 00:12:47,350 and the consequences for science and 221 00:12:57,080 --> 00:12:52,950 society and the second one was called 222 00:13:01,080 --> 00:12:57,090 towards a societal agenda for 223 00:13:07,200 --> 00:13:01,090 extraterrestrial life now some of the 224 00:13:09,930 --> 00:13:07,210 presentations were very data-rich fairly 225 00:13:13,770 --> 00:13:09,940 dry heavy scientific you know this is 226 00:13:17,010 --> 00:13:13,780 the composition of interstellar gas 227 00:13:21,330 --> 00:13:17,020 clouds that that sort of thing way above 228 00:13:23,490 --> 00:13:21,340 my head I have to say but what was 229 00:13:26,990 --> 00:13:23,500 really interesting about these two 230 00:13:30,900 --> 00:13:27,000 meetings I thought was that they were 231 00:13:33,510 --> 00:13:30,910 incredibly multidisciplinary in other 232 00:13:38,040 --> 00:13:33,520 words you didn't just have astronomers 233 00:13:44,780 --> 00:13:38,050 and cosmologists and astrophysicists but 234 00:13:48,600 --> 00:13:44,790 also psychologists anthropologists 235 00:13:51,720 --> 00:13:48,610 theologians all coming together to say 236 00:13:56,160 --> 00:13:51,730 not just hey how's the search for alien 237 00:13:58,560 --> 00:13:56,170 life going but as I say in the right at 238 00:14:02,190 --> 00:13:58,570 the beginning of this talk what happens 239 00:14:05,630 --> 00:14:02,200 if and when we find it what next now one 240 00:14:12,180 --> 00:14:05,640 of the big questions that came up is 241 00:14:16,350 --> 00:14:12,190 first contact how might things unfold if 242 00:14:21,000 --> 00:14:16,360 we receive a message from the stars 243 00:14:24,150 --> 00:14:21,010 should we reply well it might sound kind 244 00:14:26,460 --> 00:14:24,160 of obvious but I have to tell you this 245 00:14:29,010 --> 00:14:26,470 led to a huge rao and rouse at 246 00:14:31,500 --> 00:14:29,020 scientific conferences are very 247 00:14:34,200 --> 00:14:31,510 interesting to see you know they're they 248 00:14:36,810 --> 00:14:34,210 kind of polite but voices still get 249 00:14:39,300 --> 00:14:36,820 raised and people still kind of answer 250 00:14:41,880 --> 00:14:39,310 back to each other and it's a yeah it's 251 00:14:45,270 --> 00:14:41,890 pretty interesting and one of the most 252 00:14:47,850 --> 00:14:45,280 controversial subjects was if we get an 253 00:14:51,930 --> 00:14:47,860 alien message should we reply and here's 254 00:14:53,430 --> 00:14:51,940 why it's controversial stephen hawking 255 00:14:56,790 --> 00:14:53,440 probably articular 256 00:14:59,460 --> 00:14:56,800 ated it best a couple of years ago when 257 00:15:03,420 --> 00:14:59,470 he was asked about this and he said well 258 00:15:06,660 --> 00:15:03,430 you know if the human race ever 259 00:15:09,870 --> 00:15:06,670 encounters extraterrestrials it will be 260 00:15:14,400 --> 00:15:09,880 a little bit like when the European 261 00:15:19,380 --> 00:15:14,410 explorers first encountered the Native 262 00:15:23,540 --> 00:15:19,390 Americans only this time he said we will 263 00:15:26,700 --> 00:15:23,550 be the Native Americans and therefore 264 00:15:30,390 --> 00:15:26,710 Stephen Hawking argued it might not be 265 00:15:32,520 --> 00:15:30,400 so bright to immediately reply to this 266 00:15:39,380 --> 00:15:32,530 message from the cosmos and say hey yeah 267 00:15:43,260 --> 00:15:39,390 here we are done come over yeah so 268 00:15:46,590 --> 00:15:43,270 Stephen Hawking has said no we should 269 00:15:49,550 --> 00:15:46,600 not reply it would be suicide or it 270 00:15:54,960 --> 00:15:49,560 might be suicide and why take the chance 271 00:15:59,760 --> 00:15:54,970 Seth Shostak one of the best known of 272 00:16:04,820 --> 00:15:59,770 the SETI scientists said well what are 273 00:16:09,450 --> 00:16:04,830 you going to do about it in a sense it's 274 00:16:12,500 --> 00:16:09,460 too late anyway the horse has left the 275 00:16:15,660 --> 00:16:12,510 barn we have been a detectable 276 00:16:18,360 --> 00:16:15,670 civilization four decades already 277 00:16:21,090 --> 00:16:18,370 because of our military radars because 278 00:16:25,140 --> 00:16:21,100 of our radio our television because of 279 00:16:27,720 --> 00:16:25,150 some of the active SETI that we've done 280 00:16:30,450 --> 00:16:27,730 because scientists are not just 281 00:16:34,290 --> 00:16:30,460 listening for messages some of them have 282 00:16:36,300 --> 00:16:34,300 sent them proactively to so whole bunch 283 00:16:40,110 --> 00:16:36,310 of other people at the Royal Society 284 00:16:43,890 --> 00:16:40,120 said no it's too late I understand 285 00:16:46,440 --> 00:16:43,900 Stephen Hawking's objection but it's too 286 00:16:52,130 --> 00:16:46,450 late and in any case what are you going 287 00:16:56,900 --> 00:16:52,140 to do about it if a Russian radio 288 00:17:00,890 --> 00:16:56,910 telescope decides proactively to 289 00:17:05,460 --> 00:17:00,900 broadcast messages out into the cosmos 290 00:17:07,900 --> 00:17:05,470 to try and contact other civilizations 291 00:17:10,060 --> 00:17:07,910 what are we going to do we're going to 292 00:17:13,960 --> 00:17:10,070 launch a cruise missile strike against a 293 00:17:16,630 --> 00:17:13,970 radio observatory these are the sorts of 294 00:17:18,069 --> 00:17:16,640 arguments that that come up so but 295 00:17:22,480 --> 00:17:18,079 that's a big one in the scientific 296 00:17:27,430 --> 00:17:22,490 community so should we reply if we reply 297 00:17:29,820 --> 00:17:27,440 who replies and what should we say well 298 00:17:34,180 --> 00:17:29,830 that's that's the Stephen Hawking 299 00:17:36,900 --> 00:17:34,190 objection do we send a reply he very 300 00:17:40,930 --> 00:17:36,910 strongly said no another scientist 301 00:17:45,870 --> 00:17:40,940 professor Simon Conway Morris also from 302 00:17:50,830 --> 00:17:45,880 the UK he said if the cosmic phone rings 303 00:17:56,770 --> 00:17:50,840 don't answer again other people said 304 00:17:59,190 --> 00:17:56,780 it's too late who should reply that's a 305 00:18:05,790 --> 00:17:59,200 really interesting question I think 306 00:18:10,120 --> 00:18:05,800 because it raises a wider philosophical 307 00:18:15,550 --> 00:18:10,130 political question who truly speaks for 308 00:18:18,430 --> 00:18:15,560 planet Earth let's suppose we switch on 309 00:18:22,900 --> 00:18:18,440 the Square Kilometre Array and we get a 310 00:18:25,660 --> 00:18:22,910 message and then the question is asked 311 00:18:29,280 --> 00:18:25,670 okay who replies well let's see 312 00:18:32,260 --> 00:18:29,290 President of the United States arguably 313 00:18:36,190 --> 00:18:32,270 the most powerful person on the face of 314 00:18:42,220 --> 00:18:36,200 the planet but the United States is only 315 00:18:45,580 --> 00:18:42,230 one nation amongst many and arguably any 316 00:18:46,990 --> 00:18:45,590 sitting president didn't get voted for 317 00:18:49,030 --> 00:18:47,000 by a whole bunch of other people who 318 00:18:52,840 --> 00:18:49,040 voted for the other party or who didn't 319 00:18:55,870 --> 00:18:52,850 vote at all so you know is the president 320 00:18:56,980 --> 00:18:55,880 really the right person to speak for 321 00:18:59,400 --> 00:18:56,990 planet Earth what about the 322 00:19:03,880 --> 00:18:59,410 secretary-general of the United Nations 323 00:19:07,150 --> 00:19:03,890 arguably it's more representative but do 324 00:19:11,890 --> 00:19:07,160 we really want to a bureaucrat speaking 325 00:19:13,840 --> 00:19:11,900 for all of us interestingly the United 326 00:19:19,020 --> 00:19:13,850 Nations 327 00:19:21,520 --> 00:19:19,030 has something called the committee for 328 00:19:25,630 --> 00:19:21,530 know they have pardon me they have an 329 00:19:28,150 --> 00:19:25,640 office for outer space affairs who have 330 00:19:30,370 --> 00:19:28,160 briefly looked at this issue and they 331 00:19:34,320 --> 00:19:30,380 also have something called the committee 332 00:19:37,330 --> 00:19:34,330 for the peaceful uses of outer space and 333 00:19:40,299 --> 00:19:37,340 so the United Nations has kind of 334 00:19:43,779 --> 00:19:40,309 grappled with this question of who 335 00:19:48,070 --> 00:19:43,789 speaks for planet Earth and there is a 336 00:19:54,159 --> 00:19:48,080 Malaysian astrophysicist called dr. 337 00:19:56,529 --> 00:19:54,169 Maslin Othman and she chairs the office 338 00:19:58,840 --> 00:19:56,539 for outer space affairs and a few years 339 00:20:01,240 --> 00:19:58,850 ago she was one of the speakers at the 340 00:20:04,149 --> 00:20:01,250 second Royal Society meeting and she was 341 00:20:08,049 --> 00:20:04,159 one of the people put forward as a 342 00:20:11,860 --> 00:20:08,059 potential ambassador for Earth so to 343 00:20:13,720 --> 00:20:11,870 speak if if we ever made contact what 344 00:20:17,850 --> 00:20:13,730 about a religious leader what about the 345 00:20:20,590 --> 00:20:17,860 Pope well we you know read a few 346 00:20:23,080 --> 00:20:20,600 positive stories about the new pope in 347 00:20:25,360 --> 00:20:23,090 the press and how he seems to have 348 00:20:26,700 --> 00:20:25,370 impressed a lot of people but I don't 349 00:20:30,220 --> 00:20:26,710 have to tell you that the church is 350 00:20:32,830 --> 00:20:30,230 pretty controversial because of various 351 00:20:36,159 --> 00:20:32,840 allegations at the moment and in any 352 00:20:39,580 --> 00:20:36,169 sense Catholicism is only part of 353 00:20:42,340 --> 00:20:39,590 Christianity Christianity is only one of 354 00:20:46,419 --> 00:20:42,350 the world's religions and what about 355 00:20:49,990 --> 00:20:46,429 people who have no religion so again do 356 00:20:54,190 --> 00:20:50,000 we really want a religious leader being 357 00:20:57,880 --> 00:20:54,200 our spokesperson if if we communicate 358 00:20:59,950 --> 00:20:57,890 with other civilizations I probably 359 00:21:05,049 --> 00:20:59,960 don't have to tell you that the whole 360 00:21:08,100 --> 00:21:05,059 question of religion and aliens was the 361 00:21:11,649 --> 00:21:08,110 most controversial part of these 362 00:21:14,529 --> 00:21:11,659 scientific conferences I don't think 363 00:21:15,970 --> 00:21:14,539 some scientists have forgiven or 364 00:21:18,490 --> 00:21:15,980 forgotten people being burnt at the 365 00:21:20,620 --> 00:21:18,500 stake for daring to suggest that the 366 00:21:22,690 --> 00:21:20,630 earth goes around the Sun and not the 367 00:21:24,070 --> 00:21:22,700 other way around and some people 368 00:21:29,320 --> 00:21:24,080 probably still need a bit of persuading 369 00:21:32,320 --> 00:21:29,330 on that but there was a huge stand up 370 00:21:36,280 --> 00:21:32,330 Wow at the first Royal Society meeting 371 00:21:38,380 --> 00:21:36,290 between Ted Ted Peters a theologian 372 00:21:41,799 --> 00:21:38,390 whose thought about this question and 373 00:21:48,820 --> 00:21:41,809 paul davies a physicist and science 374 00:21:51,370 --> 00:21:48,830 communicator and again you know that 375 00:21:53,980 --> 00:21:51,380 here's here's an interesting question 376 00:21:55,419 --> 00:21:53,990 about science and religion and and 377 00:21:57,880 --> 00:21:55,429 things and this is one of the things 378 00:22:00,899 --> 00:21:57,890 that came up at the first meeting one of 379 00:22:04,770 --> 00:22:00,909 the great cliches that you'll hear about 380 00:22:08,110 --> 00:22:04,780 what happens when we find out for sure 381 00:22:11,110 --> 00:22:08,120 that it's not just us that there are 382 00:22:14,200 --> 00:22:11,120 other civilizations out there other life 383 00:22:16,120 --> 00:22:14,210 other civilizations some people say well 384 00:22:19,770 --> 00:22:16,130 they'd be panic in the street it would 385 00:22:23,980 --> 00:22:19,780 shatter the economic system people's 386 00:22:28,200 --> 00:22:23,990 faith in religion would be destroyed one 387 00:22:30,340 --> 00:22:28,210 of the things that these scientific 388 00:22:31,960 --> 00:22:30,350 meetings that the Royal Society 389 00:22:34,630 --> 00:22:31,970 attempted to do was address those 390 00:22:38,200 --> 00:22:34,640 cliches and say are they true turns out 391 00:22:40,060 --> 00:22:38,210 they're not true why aren't they true 392 00:22:43,870 --> 00:22:40,070 why would there not be panic in the 393 00:22:47,080 --> 00:22:43,880 streets if the president was to announce 394 00:22:51,399 --> 00:22:47,090 that hey there are other civilizations 395 00:22:53,320 --> 00:22:51,409 out there we found aliens the reason 396 00:22:55,930 --> 00:22:53,330 there would not be panic in the streets 397 00:23:01,049 --> 00:22:55,940 is because over fifty percent of people 398 00:23:04,930 --> 00:23:01,059 believe that anyway and it's a kind of 399 00:23:07,750 --> 00:23:04,940 truism that you don't shock or scare 400 00:23:11,260 --> 00:23:07,760 people just by simply telling them 401 00:23:15,850 --> 00:23:11,270 something they already believe so short 402 00:23:18,970 --> 00:23:15,860 of some sort of Hollywood war of the 403 00:23:22,600 --> 00:23:18,980 worlds alien invasion nightmare the 404 00:23:26,740 --> 00:23:22,610 simple act of saying we have found other 405 00:23:29,919 --> 00:23:26,750 life other civilizations wouldn't cause 406 00:23:31,740 --> 00:23:29,929 panic in the street finally enough 407 00:23:36,159 --> 00:23:31,750 people seem to forget that we've got a 408 00:23:38,290 --> 00:23:36,169 real world example of that how many 409 00:23:42,250 --> 00:23:38,300 people remember that in 410 00:23:43,840 --> 00:23:42,260 96 NASA did actually announced that they 411 00:23:46,690 --> 00:23:43,850 had found what they believed was 412 00:23:49,770 --> 00:23:46,700 scientific evidence of extraterrestrial 413 00:23:53,170 --> 00:23:49,780 life the so-called Martian meteorite 414 00:23:56,470 --> 00:23:53,180 remember that well it was on the front 415 00:24:00,250 --> 00:23:56,480 page of almost every single newspaper on 416 00:24:03,400 --> 00:24:00,260 the face of the planet NASA said we 417 00:24:06,700 --> 00:24:03,410 found evidence of fossilized microbial 418 00:24:11,980 --> 00:24:06,710 life okay it's not as exciting as aliens 419 00:24:14,230 --> 00:24:11,990 like that but alien life is alien life 420 00:24:16,720 --> 00:24:14,240 and NASA said you know the very 421 00:24:19,180 --> 00:24:16,730 organization that many people believed 422 00:24:21,970 --> 00:24:19,190 to be at the heart of a cover-up on this 423 00:24:26,080 --> 00:24:21,980 we're shouting it from the rooftops and 424 00:24:28,030 --> 00:24:26,090 saying we've found alien life arguably a 425 00:24:31,380 --> 00:24:28,040 lot of other scientists were we're 426 00:24:34,300 --> 00:24:31,390 saying to NASA you're being a little bit 427 00:24:38,620 --> 00:24:34,310 presumptuous on this but NASA said we 428 00:24:43,180 --> 00:24:38,630 found alien life Bill Clinton made a 429 00:24:46,450 --> 00:24:43,190 nice speech about it the radio stations 430 00:24:49,480 --> 00:24:46,460 play David Bowie song life on Mars like 431 00:24:52,990 --> 00:24:49,490 there was no tomorrow but you know what 432 00:24:55,510 --> 00:24:53,000 happened the very next day pretty much 433 00:24:58,780 --> 00:24:55,520 everyone went back to normal and that is 434 00:25:00,030 --> 00:24:58,790 likely the most realistic scenario of 435 00:25:03,880 --> 00:25:00,040 what will happen the day after 436 00:25:05,680 --> 00:25:03,890 disclosure the day after contact my good 437 00:25:07,750 --> 00:25:05,690 friend who many of you in the UFO 438 00:25:11,400 --> 00:25:07,760 community will be familiar with John 439 00:25:16,300 --> 00:25:11,410 Alexander has a little sound bite on 440 00:25:19,090 --> 00:25:16,310 disclosure and he says well that's great 441 00:25:24,340 --> 00:25:19,100 but does any of this mean I don't have 442 00:25:26,230 --> 00:25:24,350 to go to work tomorrow and sadly the 443 00:25:28,540 --> 00:25:26,240 answer to the question is well actually 444 00:25:32,290 --> 00:25:28,550 you probably do have to go back to work 445 00:25:36,070 --> 00:25:32,300 tomorrow so if it was announced that we 446 00:25:39,930 --> 00:25:36,080 found alien life good news no panic in 447 00:25:42,520 --> 00:25:39,940 the streets bad news you go back to work 448 00:25:46,810 --> 00:25:42,530 would it shatter people's religious 449 00:25:49,120 --> 00:25:46,820 faith as I say that the cliche soundbite 450 00:25:51,150 --> 00:25:49,130 that you often hear is yes it would the 451 00:25:53,880 --> 00:25:51,160 actual answer seems to be no it 452 00:25:56,520 --> 00:25:53,890 wouldn't Ted Peters one of the few 453 00:26:00,570 --> 00:25:56,530 theologians who have done direct 454 00:26:02,670 --> 00:26:00,580 research on to this did some polling and 455 00:26:07,050 --> 00:26:02,680 then some follow-up interviews here's 456 00:26:11,220 --> 00:26:07,060 what he found he found that far from 457 00:26:15,480 --> 00:26:11,230 shattering people's religious faith it 458 00:26:19,290 --> 00:26:15,490 would strengthen it and the reason that 459 00:26:22,230 --> 00:26:19,300 people said was hey well I believe in 460 00:26:24,360 --> 00:26:22,240 God but if we find that there's a whole 461 00:26:27,930 --> 00:26:24,370 bunch of other life out there in the 462 00:26:32,400 --> 00:26:27,940 universe doesn't that just make God's 463 00:26:36,150 --> 00:26:32,410 creation look bigger and and more varied 464 00:26:38,420 --> 00:26:36,160 and wonderful so so actually you 465 00:26:40,650 --> 00:26:38,430 sometimes get these counterintuitive 466 00:26:43,290 --> 00:26:40,660 findings with all these cliches about 467 00:26:47,250 --> 00:26:43,300 alien life with the interesting thing 468 00:26:51,570 --> 00:26:47,260 about religion and aliens wasn't so much 469 00:26:54,450 --> 00:26:51,580 what people's personal faith would be 470 00:26:59,280 --> 00:26:54,460 but it's what they thought about other 471 00:27:02,730 --> 00:26:59,290 religions so in other words Christians 472 00:27:04,980 --> 00:27:02,740 said well we would have no difficulty 473 00:27:09,720 --> 00:27:04,990 with this but I'm not sure about the 474 00:27:11,550 --> 00:27:09,730 Jews or the Muslims Muslims said yeah we 475 00:27:14,940 --> 00:27:11,560 could incorporate this into our 476 00:27:18,660 --> 00:27:14,950 religious faith but not not sure about 477 00:27:23,910 --> 00:27:18,670 the the Christians Buddhists were fine 478 00:27:30,530 --> 00:27:23,920 with it kind of yeah that's okay it's 479 00:27:33,840 --> 00:27:30,540 cool bring it on so anyway I digress 480 00:27:38,700 --> 00:27:33,850 bites the question who speaks for planet 481 00:27:42,000 --> 00:27:38,710 Earth or in all this discussion about 482 00:27:45,900 --> 00:27:42,010 President the Secretary General of the 483 00:27:48,750 --> 00:27:45,910 United Nations the Pope one of the 484 00:27:54,660 --> 00:27:48,760 suggestions was what about a committee 485 00:27:57,470 --> 00:27:54,670 of sages this sort of thing happens at 486 00:28:01,740 --> 00:27:57,480 scientific conferences a committee of 487 00:28:03,840 --> 00:28:01,750 sages and someone said what you know and 488 00:28:04,680 --> 00:28:03,850 it was like yeah a committee of wise 489 00:28:07,800 --> 00:28:04,690 people 490 00:28:10,410 --> 00:28:07,810 who could speak for Earth and one of the 491 00:28:13,980 --> 00:28:10,420 other scientists in the audience raised 492 00:28:16,290 --> 00:28:13,990 her hand and angrily said hey do the 493 00:28:22,170 --> 00:28:16,300 other seven billion of us get a say in 494 00:28:25,500 --> 00:28:22,180 any of this and that I think we leads to 495 00:28:28,110 --> 00:28:25,510 another quite profound question what 496 00:28:32,660 --> 00:28:28,120 about the billions of people who have no 497 00:28:36,110 --> 00:28:32,670 voice who arguably have no power and no 498 00:28:43,280 --> 00:28:36,120 say in any of this who speaks for them 499 00:28:47,850 --> 00:28:43,290 and I think if we do ever make contact 500 00:28:50,970 --> 00:28:47,860 with intelligent civilizations maybe 501 00:28:54,600 --> 00:28:50,980 they'll have some questions for us and 502 00:28:57,180 --> 00:28:54,610 maybe one of those questions will be hey 503 00:29:00,240 --> 00:28:57,190 how come is it that on this civilized 504 00:29:03,240 --> 00:29:00,250 planet where you're spending so much on 505 00:29:07,680 --> 00:29:03,250 on you know nuclear weapons and space 506 00:29:10,670 --> 00:29:07,690 probes each day tens of thousands of 507 00:29:13,800 --> 00:29:10,680 children die of preventable diseases and 508 00:29:15,990 --> 00:29:13,810 so maybe the question isn't so much what 509 00:29:18,000 --> 00:29:16,000 would our questions be for the 510 00:29:20,220 --> 00:29:18,010 extraterrestrials maybe we should ask 511 00:29:25,110 --> 00:29:20,230 ourselves what questions they might ask 512 00:29:29,270 --> 00:29:25,120 of us and I think that takes us to an 513 00:29:37,010 --> 00:29:29,280 interesting place to and maybe quite a 514 00:29:41,970 --> 00:29:37,020 disturbing place what should we say to 515 00:29:48,180 --> 00:29:41,980 another civilization you know what what 516 00:29:50,100 --> 00:29:48,190 should our message be well you know 517 00:29:52,710 --> 00:29:50,110 arguably that's the that's the best one 518 00:29:55,290 --> 00:29:52,720 to start with to reach out the hand of 519 00:29:58,170 --> 00:29:55,300 friendship and it's interesting if you 520 00:30:03,360 --> 00:29:58,180 look if you read I don't have the text 521 00:30:07,590 --> 00:30:03,370 on me but we have already sent space 522 00:30:12,870 --> 00:30:07,600 probes out into the cosmos pioneer 10 523 00:30:17,670 --> 00:30:12,880 pioneer 11 voyager 1 Voyager 2 and those 524 00:30:20,610 --> 00:30:17,680 probes have taken messages out and and 525 00:30:24,480 --> 00:30:20,620 I think the Voyager message read 526 00:30:28,550 --> 00:30:24,490 something like we take these first 527 00:30:33,180 --> 00:30:28,560 tentative steps out into the cosmos in a 528 00:30:38,550 --> 00:30:33,190 spirit of exploration and a spirit of 529 00:30:41,430 --> 00:30:38,560 peace and friendship we hope one day we 530 00:30:45,090 --> 00:30:41,440 may be called upon to learn and perhaps 531 00:30:49,650 --> 00:30:45,100 to teach and you know we look forward to 532 00:30:53,310 --> 00:30:49,660 that so but this is a big question what 533 00:30:55,290 --> 00:30:53,320 if we do pick up a message once we get 534 00:30:59,460 --> 00:30:55,300 beyond this should we reply what should 535 00:31:01,250 --> 00:30:59,470 we say SETI the SETI Institute search 536 00:31:05,190 --> 00:31:01,260 for extraterrestrial intelligence 537 00:31:09,060 --> 00:31:05,200 launched a kind of initiative a few 538 00:31:11,850 --> 00:31:09,070 years ago to gauge public opinion on 539 00:31:13,650 --> 00:31:11,860 this and test the water and see what 540 00:31:16,950 --> 00:31:13,660 people thought how many people have even 541 00:31:18,750 --> 00:31:16,960 heard of Earth's Peaks yeah they're not 542 00:31:21,450 --> 00:31:18,760 doing that you're the job I think of 543 00:31:24,630 --> 00:31:21,460 them putting it out there but it it 544 00:31:27,650 --> 00:31:24,640 basically asked the question well we're 545 00:31:30,930 --> 00:31:27,660 looking for some ideas what would you 546 00:31:34,530 --> 00:31:30,940 people say and they got some interesting 547 00:31:40,350 --> 00:31:34,540 answers back one a very clever person 548 00:31:42,780 --> 00:31:40,360 replied in binary code I think my 549 00:31:47,520 --> 00:31:42,790 favorite message that somebody suggested 550 00:31:57,110 --> 00:31:47,530 was it is very boring here and we are 551 00:32:07,190 --> 00:32:01,140 arguably we might find something a 552 00:32:11,130 --> 00:32:07,200 little bit more interesting to say hear 553 00:32:14,730 --> 00:32:11,140 hear what I think might be some 554 00:32:18,990 --> 00:32:14,740 questions that we we might like to think 555 00:32:21,060 --> 00:32:19,000 about asking meaning of life does 556 00:32:24,530 --> 00:32:21,070 consciousness survive death of the 557 00:32:27,450 --> 00:32:24,540 physical body is there a guard 558 00:32:30,930 --> 00:32:27,460 you know how can we overcome all our 559 00:32:33,750 --> 00:32:30,940 problems and the last one for definitely 560 00:32:35,910 --> 00:32:33,760 for the UFO community what what really 561 00:32:38,220 --> 00:32:35,920 happened at Roswell you know what what 562 00:32:42,300 --> 00:32:38,230 was it with you guys I once heard a 563 00:32:46,140 --> 00:32:42,310 skeptic who say to Stanton Friedman what 564 00:32:48,030 --> 00:32:46,150 would you do if aliens landed on the 565 00:32:50,790 --> 00:32:48,040 White House lawn and said yeah we're 566 00:32:57,540 --> 00:32:50,800 absolutely real but I absolutely promise 567 00:32:59,370 --> 00:32:57,550 you we didn't crash at Roswell so but 568 00:33:03,360 --> 00:32:59,380 those are the sorts of questions that 569 00:33:06,840 --> 00:33:03,370 people might be tempted to ask and in a 570 00:33:10,110 --> 00:33:06,850 sense no great surprises they are 571 00:33:19,110 --> 00:33:10,120 arguably the the big questions that we 572 00:33:24,740 --> 00:33:19,120 all want to know but I think this in and 573 00:33:29,760 --> 00:33:24,750 of itself kind of raises a dilemma and 574 00:33:33,890 --> 00:33:29,770 the dilemma is this throughout human 575 00:33:38,010 --> 00:33:33,900 history perhaps we've been at our best 576 00:33:43,500 --> 00:33:38,020 when we have struggled to overcome 577 00:33:47,130 --> 00:33:43,510 obstacles arguably it's hardwired into 578 00:33:49,500 --> 00:33:47,140 us it's what makes us human is dealing 579 00:33:52,470 --> 00:33:49,510 with problems whether it's very basic 580 00:33:56,280 --> 00:33:52,480 problems like feeding ourselves and 581 00:34:00,050 --> 00:33:56,290 clothing ourselves or whether it's more 582 00:34:04,040 --> 00:34:00,060 fundamental and more complex difficult 583 00:34:07,290 --> 00:34:04,050 problems if we encounter other 584 00:34:12,060 --> 00:34:07,300 civilizations we must face the 585 00:34:14,640 --> 00:34:12,070 possibility and indeed if if we are 586 00:34:17,490 --> 00:34:14,650 dealing with civilizations that come 587 00:34:19,500 --> 00:34:17,500 here not the possibility but almost 588 00:34:23,160 --> 00:34:19,510 certainly the absolute fact that we're 589 00:34:26,420 --> 00:34:23,170 dealing with civilizations orders of 590 00:34:32,340 --> 00:34:26,430 magnitude more advanced than our own and 591 00:34:34,440 --> 00:34:32,350 that being the case they might be in a 592 00:34:36,270 --> 00:34:34,450 position to give us the answers to some 593 00:34:36,990 --> 00:34:36,280 of these questions but would we want 594 00:34:44,310 --> 00:34:37,000 them 595 00:34:47,159 --> 00:34:44,320 that might might sound crazy why 596 00:34:50,070 --> 00:34:47,169 wouldn't we want these big answers well 597 00:34:53,550 --> 00:34:50,080 kind of same reason why it might not be 598 00:34:56,669 --> 00:34:53,560 a good idea to give a child learning a 599 00:34:59,370 --> 00:34:56,679 particular subject and coming up to an 600 00:35:02,010 --> 00:34:59,380 examination a crib sheet with all the 601 00:35:04,920 --> 00:35:02,020 test answers yeah they might get a 602 00:35:08,880 --> 00:35:04,930 hundred percent but will they truly 603 00:35:14,820 --> 00:35:08,890 develop and learn I would say no they 604 00:35:17,730 --> 00:35:14,830 won't so if we switch on the Square 605 00:35:20,820 --> 00:35:17,740 Kilometre Array and if we download if 606 00:35:25,380 --> 00:35:20,830 there is such a thing the Encyclopedia 607 00:35:28,350 --> 00:35:25,390 Galactica with all the knowledge and 608 00:35:30,960 --> 00:35:28,360 wisdom of other civilizations maybe 609 00:35:35,090 --> 00:35:30,970 millions of years more advanced than our 610 00:35:41,180 --> 00:35:35,100 own yeah we might get a short-term gain 611 00:35:44,520 --> 00:35:41,190 but would we get a long-term benefit 612 00:35:47,040 --> 00:35:44,530 aren't we as I say arguably at our best 613 00:35:50,940 --> 00:35:47,050 when we have to struggle to overcome 614 00:35:53,400 --> 00:35:50,950 adversity where we have to both 615 00:35:56,430 --> 00:35:53,410 personally and collectively as a 616 00:36:00,960 --> 00:35:56,440 civilization develop and learn and 617 00:36:07,230 --> 00:36:00,970 evolve and find out things for ourselves 618 00:36:09,450 --> 00:36:07,240 so yeah it would be good to get a cancer 619 00:36:13,050 --> 00:36:09,460 cure but maybe we should discover it for 620 00:36:16,290 --> 00:36:13,060 ourselves but that's very easy for me to 621 00:36:18,930 --> 00:36:16,300 say here but what if one of my loved 622 00:36:21,150 --> 00:36:18,940 ones was currently ill with cancer I 623 00:36:24,420 --> 00:36:21,160 expect I would change my mind this is 624 00:36:27,180 --> 00:36:24,430 why i would suggest there are very few 625 00:36:29,160 --> 00:36:27,190 black and white answers when it comes to 626 00:36:32,280 --> 00:36:29,170 these sorts of philosophical questions 627 00:36:35,550 --> 00:36:32,290 there are a lot if you'll excuse the 628 00:36:40,290 --> 00:36:35,560 youthful logical pun of gray areas here 629 00:36:42,870 --> 00:36:40,300 and but i think they are questions that 630 00:36:46,290 --> 00:36:42,880 it might be wise to think about because 631 00:36:47,540 --> 00:36:46,300 it might be 20-24 with the Square 632 00:36:50,630 --> 00:36:47,550 Kilometre Array 633 00:36:52,190 --> 00:36:50,640 it might be late today that we pick up a 634 00:36:54,710 --> 00:36:52,200 signal with our existing radio 635 00:36:58,780 --> 00:36:54,720 telescopes or it might be today that 636 00:37:02,450 --> 00:36:58,790 some whistleblower with an absolutely 637 00:37:05,030 --> 00:37:02,460 verifiable bank story says hey yeah it's 638 00:37:07,730 --> 00:37:05,040 all real or it might be later today that 639 00:37:10,570 --> 00:37:07,740 the president thinks hey end of two 640 00:37:16,430 --> 00:37:10,580 terms why not I'll just disclosed okay 641 00:37:20,240 --> 00:37:16,440 it's real so it's arguably worth 642 00:37:23,900 --> 00:37:20,250 thinking about these questions sooner 643 00:37:27,710 --> 00:37:23,910 rather than later some other you know 644 00:37:31,240 --> 00:37:27,720 the here are some of those things I 645 00:37:34,160 --> 00:37:31,250 think I think one of the great 646 00:37:36,500 --> 00:37:34,170 imponderables with all of this is you 647 00:37:40,000 --> 00:37:36,510 know we kind of assume that if we 648 00:37:42,650 --> 00:37:40,010 encounter an advanced civilization that 649 00:37:45,410 --> 00:37:42,660 they'll be almost indistinguishable from 650 00:37:49,060 --> 00:37:45,420 gods and indeed there is that classic 651 00:37:52,280 --> 00:37:49,070 arthur c clarke quote any science 652 00:37:55,040 --> 00:37:52,290 sufficiently advanced from our own will 653 00:37:59,410 --> 00:37:55,050 be indistinguishable from magic and it 654 00:38:01,670 --> 00:37:59,420 may be that to us some of these advanced 655 00:38:08,540 --> 00:38:01,680 civilizations are almost 656 00:38:10,520 --> 00:38:08,550 indistinguishable from God's but if we 657 00:38:14,270 --> 00:38:10,530 look at some of the folklore that we are 658 00:38:18,410 --> 00:38:14,280 told about you know Greek and Roman gods 659 00:38:20,840 --> 00:38:18,420 and the gods were great tricksters so 660 00:38:25,780 --> 00:38:20,850 why should we assume that anything that 661 00:38:32,120 --> 00:38:25,790 we are told by extraterrestrials is true 662 00:38:35,450 --> 00:38:32,130 hey humans lie why shouldn't aliens more 663 00:38:37,700 --> 00:38:35,460 likely scenario if we find alien life 664 00:38:39,200 --> 00:38:37,710 we're not just going to find one other 665 00:38:41,810 --> 00:38:39,210 planet out there we're going to find a 666 00:38:44,120 --> 00:38:41,820 whole bunch of them some of the more 667 00:38:46,310 --> 00:38:44,130 advanced than us some less some pretty 668 00:38:49,010 --> 00:38:46,320 much at the same level you know it's the 669 00:38:50,630 --> 00:38:49,020 kind of science of of probability 670 00:38:52,850 --> 00:38:50,640 chances are we're in the middle of 671 00:38:56,320 --> 00:38:52,860 things you know we are not going to be 672 00:38:58,740 --> 00:38:56,330 the most advanced planet in the universe 673 00:39:00,900 --> 00:38:58,750 that'd be pretty scary 674 00:39:03,900 --> 00:39:00,910 we probably won't be the least either 675 00:39:06,690 --> 00:39:03,910 will chances are statistically you'll be 676 00:39:07,920 --> 00:39:06,700 somewhere in the middle and therefore 677 00:39:09,870 --> 00:39:07,930 there'll be a whole bunch of other 678 00:39:12,660 --> 00:39:09,880 civilizations and they won't all speak 679 00:39:15,150 --> 00:39:12,670 with one voice maybe David can talk in 680 00:39:17,400 --> 00:39:15,160 his presentation about the kind of Star 681 00:39:19,020 --> 00:39:17,410 Trek Federation idea the United 682 00:39:21,120 --> 00:39:19,030 Federation of Planets there may be 683 00:39:22,380 --> 00:39:21,130 something like that there may not there 684 00:39:25,110 --> 00:39:22,390 may be a whole bunch of different 685 00:39:27,870 --> 00:39:25,120 Federation's but it's unlikely that 686 00:39:30,660 --> 00:39:27,880 there'll be a single universal truth and 687 00:39:34,740 --> 00:39:30,670 a single Universal answer we might not 688 00:39:38,040 --> 00:39:34,750 like some of the answers what if planet 689 00:39:41,520 --> 00:39:38,050 Earth is a science experiment what if 690 00:39:47,130 --> 00:39:41,530 planet Earth is a farm what if planet 691 00:39:50,940 --> 00:39:47,140 Earth is a mental in Sylum or prison 692 00:39:56,610 --> 00:39:50,950 planet what if planet Earth is a reality 693 00:39:59,250 --> 00:39:56,620 TV show and as I say what if the answers 694 00:40:01,620 --> 00:39:59,260 harm us what if we get everything on a 695 00:40:07,400 --> 00:40:01,630 plate and then we kind of lose the that 696 00:40:12,170 --> 00:40:09,980 what if we don't understand the message 697 00:40:17,930 --> 00:40:12,180 wouldn't that be one of the most 698 00:40:21,060 --> 00:40:17,940 interesting and possibly frustrating 699 00:40:23,190 --> 00:40:21,070 situations of all that you would pick up 700 00:40:25,500 --> 00:40:23,200 a signal and you would know for a fact 701 00:40:28,830 --> 00:40:25,510 but there are other civilizations out 702 00:40:31,410 --> 00:40:28,840 there but maybe we'd never meet them and 703 00:40:34,590 --> 00:40:31,420 maybe we'd never be able to understand 704 00:40:37,560 --> 00:40:34,600 them or their mice and that would be 705 00:40:40,320 --> 00:40:37,570 very kind of but one of those really 706 00:40:43,860 --> 00:40:40,330 truly interesting philosophical debates 707 00:40:46,230 --> 00:40:43,870 and here's another question what if the 708 00:40:49,290 --> 00:40:46,240 scientific community pick up a message 709 00:40:51,810 --> 00:40:49,300 they can't understand now SETI have said 710 00:40:54,720 --> 00:40:51,820 if we find a signal number one will 711 00:40:56,700 --> 00:40:54,730 verify with other scientists and number 712 00:40:59,730 --> 00:40:56,710 two will tell everyone remember that 713 00:41:02,670 --> 00:40:59,740 great line in the movie contact where 714 00:41:06,870 --> 00:41:02,680 they say to Ellie Arroway who do we tell 715 00:41:09,150 --> 00:41:06,880 now and she says everyone well can you 716 00:41:11,430 --> 00:41:09,160 imagine the government being comfortable 717 00:41:13,620 --> 00:41:11,440 with the scientific community picking up 718 00:41:18,329 --> 00:41:13,630 signal that we can't understand and then 719 00:41:23,250 --> 00:41:18,339 releasing it what if it's the formula 720 00:41:27,620 --> 00:41:23,260 for some fantastic device that will 721 00:41:34,050 --> 00:41:27,630 enable us to generate almost unlimited 722 00:41:36,809 --> 00:41:34,060 cheap clean energy great you might say 723 00:41:41,309 --> 00:41:36,819 but do we not on this planet have a 724 00:41:43,800 --> 00:41:41,319 habit of abusing things like that one of 725 00:41:46,770 --> 00:41:43,810 my other favorite movies is the Medusa 726 00:41:50,370 --> 00:41:46,780 touch one of Richard Burton's movies and 727 00:41:53,460 --> 00:41:50,380 as a scene in there where he says we 728 00:41:59,910 --> 00:41:53,470 discover we find out what powers the Sun 729 00:42:03,240 --> 00:41:59,920 and we make a bomb out of it what if an 730 00:42:05,940 --> 00:42:03,250 extraterrestrial message is this 731 00:42:09,300 --> 00:42:05,950 incredibly powerful source of energy 732 00:42:13,410 --> 00:42:09,310 won't there be someone here that decides 733 00:42:15,359 --> 00:42:13,420 to weaponize it maybe that'll be your 734 00:42:19,160 --> 00:42:15,369 government but maybe it will be a 735 00:42:21,960 --> 00:42:19,170 jihadist terrorist so there are some 736 00:42:25,859 --> 00:42:21,970 questions about the whole 737 00:42:28,410 --> 00:42:25,869 interrelationship between the scientific 738 00:42:33,030 --> 00:42:28,420 community and the governmental community 739 00:42:35,309 --> 00:42:33,040 I have pretty much used out my time but 740 00:42:36,900 --> 00:42:35,319 I think I might manage to squeeze in two 741 00:42:39,089 --> 00:42:36,910 or three minutes of questions so thank 742 00:42:48,380 --> 00:42:39,099 you very much for listening and thank 743 00:43:06,019 --> 00:42:50,779 I I do have time to take a few very 744 00:43:10,339 --> 00:43:06,029 brief questions close your have already 745 00:43:12,799 --> 00:43:10,349 happened happened 40 2067 babies 746 00:43:15,950 --> 00:43:12,809 mountains by the ground and he puts 747 00:43:25,009 --> 00:43:15,960 applying slowly on the news media not 748 00:43:28,579 --> 00:43:25,019 paying attention yep the military yes 749 00:43:33,259 --> 00:43:28,589 that's certainly true that if you placed 750 00:43:35,180 --> 00:43:33,269 end to end the information on UFOs that 751 00:43:39,859 --> 00:43:35,190 governments around the world have 752 00:43:42,980 --> 00:43:39,869 already put out arguably that does 753 00:43:44,900 --> 00:43:42,990 constitute a form of disclosure now I 754 00:43:47,269 --> 00:43:44,910 think it might be disclosure with a 755 00:43:48,890 --> 00:43:47,279 little D as opposed to with a big d 756 00:43:51,710 --> 00:43:48,900 which is a debate that I've had with 757 00:43:54,049 --> 00:43:51,720 people like steve bassett before but yes 758 00:43:57,130 --> 00:43:54,059 the british government who i worked for 759 00:44:00,349 --> 00:43:57,140 is a good example of what you just said 760 00:44:02,569 --> 00:44:00,359 for years we told parliament the media 761 00:44:05,240 --> 00:44:02,579 and the public that this was a subject 762 00:44:07,759 --> 00:44:05,250 where we put out you know we had very 763 00:44:11,329 --> 00:44:07,769 little interest when we released the 764 00:44:13,069 --> 00:44:11,339 files there were 55,000 pages of 765 00:44:16,579 --> 00:44:13,079 documents so there's a lot of 766 00:44:18,589 --> 00:44:16,589 information already out there any other 767 00:44:22,400 --> 00:44:18,599 questions particularly on science 768 00:44:27,559 --> 00:44:22,410 religion disclosure and anything anyone 769 00:44:34,940 --> 00:44:31,859 what did they come up with yeah the 770 00:44:38,640 --> 00:44:34,950 Royal Society came up with no definitive 771 00:44:41,220 --> 00:44:38,650 answer to that question who speaks for 772 00:44:45,180 --> 00:44:41,230 planet Earth all of the people that I 773 00:44:50,370 --> 00:44:45,190 put up there were mentioned I think the 774 00:44:52,950 --> 00:44:50,380 sense that I got was that the scientists 775 00:44:55,559 --> 00:44:52,960 would rather that scientists speak for 776 00:44:58,319 --> 00:44:55,569 planet Earth as opposed to politicians I 777 00:45:00,000 --> 00:44:58,329 can see the merit of that but I'm sure 778 00:45:02,250 --> 00:45:00,010 that the politicians would see it 779 00:45:05,940 --> 00:45:02,260 exactly the other way around I kind of 780 00:45:08,460 --> 00:45:05,950 think that it's a self-selecting kind of 781 00:45:11,460 --> 00:45:08,470 situation that because this was a 782 00:45:13,980 --> 00:45:11,470 scientific conference of course the 783 00:45:15,990 --> 00:45:13,990 sense of it was probably that scientists 784 00:45:19,230 --> 00:45:16,000 would have a better case for speaking if 785 00:45:21,870 --> 00:45:19,240 it was a theological conference I'm sure 786 00:45:25,589 --> 00:45:21,880 they would feel theologians had a better 787 00:45:28,190 --> 00:45:25,599 case but there was no definitive hey 788 00:45:37,309 --> 00:45:28,200 this is the personal this is the group 789 00:45:45,480 --> 00:45:42,420 yes well this is the one of the most 790 00:45:48,000 --> 00:45:45,490 compelling waves of UFO sightings in 791 00:45:51,690 --> 00:45:48,010 modern history but the so-called Belgian 792 00:45:54,240 --> 00:45:51,700 wave late nineteen ninety and 793 00:45:57,450 --> 00:45:54,250 particularly the night of March 30th and 794 00:46:01,260 --> 00:45:57,460 31st 1991 where the belgian air force 795 00:46:05,609 --> 00:46:01,270 actually scrambled two f-16 fighters in 796 00:46:10,109 --> 00:46:05,619 an unsuccessful attempt to intercept a 797 00:46:14,250 --> 00:46:10,119 UFO that was being tracked on radar the 798 00:46:16,400 --> 00:46:14,260 belgian air force and government said we 799 00:46:19,380 --> 00:46:16,410 don't know what this is but it was real 800 00:46:21,750 --> 00:46:19,390 the Americans were asked through the 801 00:46:24,030 --> 00:46:21,760 embassies I was peripherally involved 802 00:46:27,750 --> 00:46:24,040 and ask some questions through the 803 00:46:31,740 --> 00:46:27,760 British Embassy again I think it it ties 804 00:46:34,309 --> 00:46:31,750 back into the point that Kenneth just 805 00:46:38,839 --> 00:46:34,319 made about maybe disclosure has already 806 00:46:41,760 --> 00:46:38,849 happened maybe we should get beyond this 807 00:46:43,559 --> 00:46:41,770 you know is it real or is it not and say 808 00:46:46,319 --> 00:46:43,569 hey yeah you know there's enough 809 00:46:48,390 --> 00:46:46,329 information out there verified by 810 00:46:52,740 --> 00:46:48,400 governments itself I mean General de 811 00:46:54,930 --> 00:46:52,750 Brouwer you know the Belgian chief of 812 00:46:57,990 --> 00:46:54,940 staff for the Air Force he was the one 813 00:47:02,400 --> 00:46:58,000 saying and he continues to say this is 814 00:47:05,700 --> 00:47:02,410 real this is solid and his kind of under 815 00:47:07,680 --> 00:47:05,710 the breath postscript was you know thank 816 00:47:10,200 --> 00:47:07,690 goodness they weren't hostile because if 817 00:47:12,300 --> 00:47:10,210 they had have been the speeds and 818 00:47:14,069 --> 00:47:12,310 maneuvers of that thing we would not 819 00:47:15,839 --> 00:47:14,079 have been able to do a thing about it so 820 00:47:17,460 --> 00:47:15,849 maybe that's a good sign I I've been 821 00:47:33,080 --> 00:47:17,470 told we have time for one last very 822 00:47:38,550 --> 00:47:36,660 yes I think there is an argument that 823 00:47:41,070 --> 00:47:38,560 says they would be doing exactly that 824 00:47:43,560 --> 00:47:41,080 but they suppose the question is then 825 00:47:46,200 --> 00:47:43,570 how would they be speaking to scientists 826 00:47:49,440 --> 00:47:46,210 one answer to that is that they would be 827 00:47:54,360 --> 00:47:49,450 using something that they know we use IE 828 00:47:56,490 --> 00:47:54,370 radio so that's I guess one reason why 829 00:47:59,070 --> 00:47:56,500 listening for a radio signal with a 830 00:48:02,180 --> 00:47:59,080 radio telescope is logical but in my 831 00:48:05,730 --> 00:48:02,190 mischievous moments which I do have I 832 00:48:07,740 --> 00:48:05,740 suspect that extraterrestrials will be 833 00:48:10,200 --> 00:48:07,750 able to do rather more advanced things 834 00:48:13,050 --> 00:48:10,210 one of the things that I kind of 835 00:48:16,410 --> 00:48:13,060 speculate is they would have the 836 00:48:18,630 --> 00:48:16,420 capability to simultaneously send every 837 00:48:21,960 --> 00:48:18,640 single person on the face of this planet 838 00:48:25,050 --> 00:48:21,970 who has an internet connection and an 839 00:48:26,610 --> 00:48:25,060 email account an email and if every 840 00:48:29,820 --> 00:48:26,620 single person on the face of the planet 841 00:48:32,640 --> 00:48:29,830 got the same email in a way that's quite 842 00:48:34,800 --> 00:48:32,650 an egalitarian way of them making 843 00:48:39,320 --> 00:48:34,810 contact with us in a way that doesn't 844 00:48:43,140 --> 00:48:39,330 favor any one particular country 845 00:48:46,230 --> 00:48:43,150 politics religion etc so what's your 846 00:48:53,490 --> 00:48:46,240 inbox an email from et thank you very